I just read Ady's post on sailing at the Wall. It sounds like his encounter with the police went pretty well. I wanted to see if we could start a discussion on how best to handle such encounters to avoid putting 87th street on the police department's radar, and also share ideas of how to improve the chances we'll be left alone while windsurfing there, and maybe, find a route to make launching there legit.

I'd like to hear input on a few particular topics as well. For example: should we park on the access road while we're rigging or not? if so, move cars back to the parking lot when sailing? If we're confronted by police, should we try and explain what we're doing, or just comply without argument? Would it be useful for windsurfers to visit that park on non-windsurfing days (walk dogs, land-sail, ride bikes, have a cook-out) to make themselves known to police on that beat as decent folks?

Anyone not familiar with the situation at 87th street. Here's the deal. It's a great flat water spot just south of a large sea-wall at 87th street on Lake Michigan. The park, Steelworker's park, is on the site of an old steel mill. The shoreline is rip-rap consisting of some poured in place concrete structures, some stone local stone, but mostly rock that seems a byproduct of past processing activities (some slaggy inclusions). There is no designated launch area at the park.
There is private security almost always there, they are paid by the steel company to keep people from trespassing on the steel-works ruins and away form the canal (north of the wall). Don't walk around North of the Wall (or even directly West of it) unless you have good light or are familiar with the area (there are a couple large 'holes' that could be lethal. The private security are almost always there (white vehicles) and have never bothered anybody as far as I know. Chicago police also make rounds, (often they just want to make sure everyone is okay and tell you to have fun). Occasionally, though, police raise issues - sometimes in a friendly way. Occasionally police will seem to misunderstand the nature of windsurfing - possibly confusing it with Kite-boarding.

What are peoples ideas about the best way to maintain the access we currently enjoy (even though it's not perfect)?

Here's mine: I like the idea of making it a totally legit launch, but short of doing that, it seems like keeping encounters low-profile is best - for everyone.

If an occasional officer asks someone to leave or not to park in a certain spot, it's probably best to comply without argument. That way no paper-work gets filed and the officer is likely to forget about it before the end of the shift. The last thing we want is an incident that sticks in the offers' mind, and becomes a topic for discussion with other officers, or with his captain.

Of course, chicago surfers were eventually able to gain legal access only after a high-profile surfer arrest, but as the access at 87th street really is quite hazardous, I can't imagine a similar result from a police confrontation at 87th street. Not that legal access there isn't a possibility, but i think it'd have to come about through other means.

Other input? Do you think we should park on the service road to rig and then move before launching? Should we avoid using that road at all?
I'm moving down to that neighborhood in a couple weeks. Anyone want to cookout at the park with me and bring burgers to share for police making rounds?

Water Access has been and is a continuing challenge for a Windsurfer. Over the past thirty years the best success stories (I've been aware of) have resulted from open, formal communications, usually at city planning and zoning meetings. These meetings are where many groups challenging water access (e.g., US Coast Guard, National Park Service, City Police, Private Business, etc.) attend and are represented.

Properly defining the issues and then being prepared to discuss the issues and, their solutions, at formal meetings is most important. What's the problem? What law is being broken? What is the safety concern?

Example 1: Not supposed to do it from there as it is too dangerous on those rocks. Question: What rule or law is being broken, specifically? How can the rocks be made safe? Discussion: Slippery rocks was the exact issue on the seawall at the Ocracoke Island visitors parking lot. The solution was to place a suitable carpet over the rocks at that spot. The carpet was @ 12’ x 12’ (dark green) outdoor carpet anchored on the edges with available rocks). This solution was presented and accepted at the city council meeting. Note: Such a simple solution. And, the carpet was so much nicer to cross over and so much easier on equipment than barnacles. (BTW: That section of carpeted rock has since been replaced by a nice boat ramp, grass rigging area and, picnic tables... Sweeett...)

Example 2: Windsurfing off the coast of the city of Myrtle Beach, SC was illegal for years except in designated “surf zones”. The issue was a concern for possibly hitting vacationing swimmers. The major issue turned out to be grouping windsurfing with ‘all recreational boating’. Once the mechanics of windsurfing was presented to the city council a solution was provided as follows:

"c. Sailboats, Sail Boards, Kite Surfing Boards, and like devices. It shall be unlawful to operate any sailboat, sail board, kite surfing boards and like devices in the waters of the Atlantic Ocean within 100 yards of the point where the Atlantic Ocean adjoins the public beach during the period from May 1 up to and including Labor Day of any year, except that such devices listed above may be launched from and returned to the beach on a course approximately perpendicular to the beach. When launching or returning as described above, such devices listed above shall be operated as slowly as surf conditions shall permit and in such a manner as to avoid all swimmers or other persons in the water."

This said, the rules are also clear as to the “Authority of beach patrol officers and their agents as to swimmers, and persons on the beach.”

www.cityofmyrtlebeach.com/beachlaws.html

So, it’s important to remain polite and respectful.

I always make a point to approach a passing Beach Patrol (police) and/or lifeguard on duty to discuss my intentions, mutual understanding of the 'current' rules, etc. (jelly fish, wind, weather, ....) When sailing alone, I also ask them to keep half an eye on me, if they understand the universal distress signal (hands waving overhead), and to please call the Coast Guard if they see me use the distress signal.

An organization like the US Windsurfing Association (which was established a long time ago) may be able to help define common issues, not so common issues and, their resolutions.

uswindsurfing.org/contact/

I don't really care much about the 87th st launch-I used it one single time last year and climbing back was rather difficult. I'm fine with launching from the boat ramps. BUT if you guys find a way to legalize it I'll fully support you. Meanwhile just follow David's advice and maybe wait for the cop to show up and then rig quickly and launch after he leaves.

I support the idea of legalizing this world famous spectacular spot...It is actually the best spot for flat water sailing in north winds (and other directions) in whole Chicago area with steady consistent winds. Of course if you do not preffer to be wavesailing on this days..
We could make appointment with South Chicago Development office next to the park entrance and have a clear friendly discussion. Rules are made by people and if we know what we are doing and the office understand better what we are doing, there is sollution for everything.
Finaly the city spend a lot of effort to make this park nice, so it should have public water access.. as part of michigan lake water trail access program for example..
many kayakers and fisherman will be happy to hang around there...
www.openlands.org/63rd-street-beach-to-calumet-park-boat-ramp
There are different plans for future of this site already done, so the city needs know why it is importand to adjust it for now.. Nothing is final. If we do not let them know what we need and why it is importand for us, they will never know.
chicagolakesidedevelopment.com/vision
I think the spot is very safe, the access to water can be improved by simple and not expensive way of adjusting the rocks position, and possilble carpets (great idea!), some growel around access point...There is also break area beach by the edge of the wall. Rigging and parking is easy from the turnaround with close walking distance. The road around lake should be left for easy access for Patrol/Police. Parking on small park roads is generally not accepted in any of Chicago parks and therefore might catch officials eye???
It is great place, so lets keep it great!
If there is someone who helped to approve windsurfing access to other Chicago beaches on noth side, please help us.

I have never launched at 87th, but I can see the appeal of it on a N-NNE day.

Can anyone reach out to an existing surf advocacy organization (e.g., Surfrider) to make them aware this particular issue?

Seems to me far easier to use existing channels (if open) than to re-invent the wheel.

I think we need to get in touch with this people:
www.openlands.org/calumet-area

I spoke with Richard last night. He seemed exciting to help do some work on this. We're thinking about getting together sometime during the week of 4/6/15 to discuss more and possibly come-up with a plan of action. Anyone else interested?

Even in the best case, access will continue to be non-legit for at least a while. In order to keep this access "tolerated" for as long as possible, I'd like to suggest a few things that will, hopefully, keep official objections to a minimum. I'm not trying to dictate here; just want to offer some clear suggestions. Differing opinions are welcome; especially if brought up for discussion.

1) Parking Most objections brought up by police started with parking on or using the access road. It's very convenient to drop gear off on the access road, and then park in the lot. It's even more convenient to park on the access road and leave your vehicle there even while sailing. However, from the perspective of keeping access long-term, it's probably best to keep vehicles off the access road entirely (Someone had already recommended this in another thread). 4-way flashers while dropping stuff at the east end of the circle, and then parking in lot as soon as possible is probably okay. I'm open to other suggestions, but until then, let's try to set a good example and keep off the access road and encourage other WS to do so as well. Objections? It is a way to carry gear, especially if you don't know exactly what gear you'll need. Reid posted a gear cart that might be helpful under the equipment section for anyone who objects to the haul.

Interactions with Police Generally speaking, whenever confronted with Police (if you think you're under suspicion) it's best to say as little as possible. At least as far as keeping yourself out of trouble. As far as promoting access, it's theoretically possible that discussing our situation with police might be productive, unfortunately, it's just as likely to go very poorly, even if you are polite. Police do have a difficult job. By the time they are confronting you because you're doing something questionable, it's probably too late to have a productive conversation about access. At this point, it's there job to collect evidence and testimony about the possible violation. Not to say that police act like robots, but only that they have a job to do. In fact, most Police are very good at this part of their job. You may think you're having a friendly discussion about improving lake-shore access, meanwhile the police are taking careful notes as you continue to incriminate yourself.

Discussing with police before you start to engage in questionable activities is also problematic. Doug posted some ideas about this, and I agree in a certain way. At the same time, you're also putting the police in a difficult position. (drawing attention to borderline sketchy-action about to occur and also asking them if "it's cool").

What's a problem, what's not Previous posts recommended a "get in, get out, disappear" approach. I don't think this is a bad idea; keep a low profile. At the same time, it's probably smart for everyone to have an understanding of the relevant laws, and realize that most windsurf activities are already totally legal. Just because you're in a wetsuit, doesn't mean you have to explain yourself. Understand the law and realize there are many scenarios that don't involve any infractions. Whatever portion of the activity might be questionable, by all means, get it over with quickly.

Any other/ or different thoughts?