Most excellent nice weather warm water sailing day at Greenwood, 6.0 conditions from 8 to 11, 7.0 until 4, with gradually building shore break that was never too challenging but still batten breaking on Gerry's Retros (4 battens total from 2 different sails). Maybe 10 people total, 4-6 on the water at a time. Here's a short vid clip, nice view of Chicago skyline after my blown jibe.

Thanks for posting the vid David, fun day! Called sailworks this morning to get the new tubes ordered, and Bruce Peterson answered! Gotta love the accessibility of the pros and legends of our sport!

He claims the latest tube battens are stronger, but bottom line is that retros cannot take a washing, even a relatively mild one. Yesterday I rigged too small (6.5, needed 7.5) and got knocked down in the shorebreak, with no power. There wasn't enough to waterstart (at least for me!) and I could still touch bottom so I worked my way back in, got washed over by several waves but nothing crazy. The result was three broken battens. Rigged the 7.5 with bigger board and went back out, had a great time. But on the way back in to the beach I went down in the whitewater on the very last wave when my fin hit bottom, and the sail was hit by two (small) waves before I got it up and out. That was enough to break one of the battens. The 7.5 is a 2006 (I looked it up) so I guess I can't complain too much about that one. But I have 4 retros and have broken battens on all 4 of them, and after losing 4 in one day yesterday I am tired of being an expert in retro batten repairs!! I have literally never had to replace a batten on any other sail brand, and that includes my 6.0 Ezzy and 5.4 NP, both of which have taken much worse poundings. So the 6.5 and 7.5 will be phased out, I also have 8.5 and 10.5 retros but not a big issue since those rarely fall into the water.

This is from the iwindsurf forum, and I could not agree more: "RDMs (even 490s) hold up better in surf, but surf (even shore break) can break anything. I love Retros, but Retro battens are not designed to survive waves. Like I said, if you're riding waves, a Retro is not your call."

Not that I'm exactly riding a lot of waves, but our shorebreak can be pretty heavy for 6.5 conditions. If anyone can recommend a 6.5 that is durable and rigs on a constant curve RDM 460, I'm all ears (I also have a constant curve SDM 460). Would love to trade for a 6.5 Retro with replaced battens Was thinking about Ezzy but Bruce said they are flex tip, I am assuming he is right - ?

Gerry, Ezzy's have been constant curve mast for years. Also no tube battens in any of the lines. Tube battens can be stiffer but are vulnerable to breakage. I like the Ezzy 5 batten wave sails. My 6.9 Ezzy Tiger rigs on a 460 RDM (constant curve) with a boom length of only 188 cm. The 6.4 rigs on a 430 for even lighter swing weight. Goya Sails is another place to look (constant curve mast). Sailworks seem to be on the hard top mast side.

Greenwood can be brutal. We had a buddy just standing in the shorebreak getting ready to launch and a wave crashed on his sail just laying on top of the water and snapped his mast.

David Mark wrote:

Nice vid, David. I like the steadicam-ness. Looks like some nice ramps on the way out.

Thanks Reid, I guess we can't expect Bruce to be an expert on competitors products! You are absolutely right, I saw the same thing on Ezzy's site after I posted. Definitely focusing on ezzy and goya, only problem is my 430 mast is a cheapo 40% carbon chinook, the only sail it fits is my 6.0 ezzy so I couldn't justify a better one. So now I am looking at a new mast as well !

Gerry wrote:
To add, Ezzy sort of sits alone in their built-in 3D profile. I call them the most "cammed" non cammed sails. And you'll have to see if you're a fan of that or not I'm sure there are some Ezzys at Greenwood you can look at on the beach.

Dropping a couple of wind graphs from the day. Nice!

Wilmette Buoy



Crib

According to Unifiber Ezzy and Sailworks have the same bend. I don’t think either brand is known for being overly mast sensitive.

David Mark wrote:
Similar bends. Ezzy masts used to be made by NoLimitz (up until about two years ago). Ezzy Hookipa masts were very close to the NoLimitz Sumo. Ezzy masts are now made elsewhere but assume the bend is similar. NoLimitz also makes some of the Goya masts. The Goya RDM 90 is also very close to the NoLimitz Sumo but the Goya is a hair more flex top.

Sailworks sells the NoLimitz masts to use in their sails. The Sumo and the Original Skinny have similar bends but the Original Skinny is softer flex overall.

Hope this helps!

also while we are geeking out on mast bends, the term "constant curve" when applied to windsurfing masts essentially describes a mast that flexes more in the top than in the base.

I can't remember all the specific details, but if you hang a weight from the center of mast and measure the 1/4, 1/2, and 3/4 point deflection and look at the differences relative to the mid point deflection, that's how mast curve is measured... although it's a crude measurement and not really reflective of the actual curve of the mast. Also, bend consistency is a whole other issue as is bend consistency from mast model to model within the same brand range.

But say you hang your weight form the mast and suspend it from the two ends and the center deflects 50cm. Then you measure the deflection at the quarter points. Her's an example

Constant Curve: ~12 points
center: 50cm
top 1/4: 38cm
bottom 1/4: 26cm
38cm minus 26cm gets you your 12 points which qualifies as constant curve. the 50cm center deflection would go into a formula to get you your stiffness

Flex Top: ~14+ points
center: 50cm
top 1/4: 40cm
bottom 1/4: 26cm
40cm minus 26cm gets you your 14 points so this mast is flex top. Same center deflection as above so same MCS/IMCS number (stiffness)

Hard top ~10 or fewer points
center: 50cm
top 1/4: 36m
bottom 1/4: 26cm
36cm minus 26cm is 10 points difference. Hard top.

Hard top #2: same 10 point difference as above but with a different bend:
center: 50cm
top 1/4: 40cm
bottom 1/4: 30cm
both the above masts have a 10 point difference so qualify as hard top but the overall bends are totally different

Been awhile since I thought of this stuff, so hope i am remembering correctly

Reid Fillman wrote:
The image stabilization of Hero8 is pretty amazing, had no idea it would come out this smooth. There is a "boost" setting that is supposed to do even more.